Insta Death Crates (Updated 20/10/2001) Proof you can go grey from traps. Cleaned it up a bit removing the confusing garbage from OSI.

[Lusty]

This thread needs sticky tape on it, don't make me keep bumping it.

[Jaymez]

Using the Unlock spell didnt work, I had to pick the crate.

Lyric- Unemployed west region Counselor

[Lusty]

<blockquote><hr>

Note: At Gm Tinker you will need a GM Mage to Unlock it, even at lower levels you may still require a Gm Mage. Just use a GM Mage damnit.

<hr></blockquote>

Is this criteria met?

[DariusOakman]

Tried it...it didn't work.
Make crate, trap it, lock it with key, turn by putting on floor, magic unlock (spell has no effect)--tried on floor and in pack.
Try opening...it's locked. click once on box display is "exceptional crate" and i get no contents information. Turn North/south and try opening and it opens. Click crate display is "exceptional crate" and i get no contents information.

What am i doing wrong?



Darius Oakman, GM Artisan
Atlantic Shard
Trammelite Merchant
Founder: United Artisans of Britannia

[DariusOakman]

OK...GM mage just unlocked and I'm getting the contents information when i single click...here's the question...

Who owns the trap? My tinker or my mage? Mage i bet.


Darius Oakman, GM Artisan
Atlantic Shard
Trammelite Merchant
Founder: United Artisans of Britannia

[Jaymez]

An easier way(if you have the room) is to make a 50/50 skill carpentar/tinker(sp?) and use him/her to make the crates. Then have your tinker trap them, unlocking them will be much easier . The skill of the maker of the crate and not the tinker who trapped it is checked when an attempt is made to unlock.

Lyric- Unemployed west region Counselor<P ID="edit"><FONT class="small">Edited by Jaymez on 08/12/01 03:23 AM.</FONT></P>

[Lusty]

<blockquote><hr>

The Owner of the trap is dedfined by the player that last enabled the trap and is responsible for all the deaths that occur from the trap.

<hr></blockquote>


Thats in the Guide.

Like my new pic? LOL

[DariusOakman]

Crate on mage. North/South couldn't open at all. East/West 84pts damage from GE potion. Second time 100 pts of damage...glad i cast bless first.


Darius Oakman, GM Artisan
Atlantic Shard
Trammelite Merchant
Founder: United Artisans of Britannia

[Lusty]

Yes, and it's all in the Guide, glad you are getting the same results. Btw strength of potion used makes no difference, it's all tinker skill. Guess I should add that.

Wait till you get a freak explosion, that does 150+ damage, scary stuff.<P ID="edit"><FONT class="small">Edited by Lusty on 08/12/01 03:30 AM.</FONT></P>

[DariusOakman]

You are God Lusty. I shall sacrifice my first born Llama in your honour.
now i gotta check that criminal stuff.....don't want mage to be perma pissed.


Darius Oakman, GM Artisan
Atlantic Shard
Trammelite Merchant
Founder: United Artisans of Britannia

[DariusOakman]

BTW my tinker is 84 with 80 magery. He couldn't unlock with spell. just for the record books.


Darius Oakman, GM Artisan
Atlantic Shard
Trammelite Merchant
Founder: United Artisans of Britannia

[Lusty]

Your mage has nothing to do with the crates, if you ever get the option to report as murder your tinker, do it. (just once)
Then log in your tinker to see if he got it. Now you know you reported him, and yet when the tinker considers his sins, he has not slain the innocent, or whatever it is now.

The mage has absolutely nothing to fear from the trap, (murder count wise), actually nobody does.

[DariusOakman]

The criminal aspect of this is interesting. You can never recieve a murder count but in theory a person could use that crate and keep killing themself and the owner would stay grey. (As long as both were on at the same time.) Is this a reasonable interpretation of your guide Lusty?


Darius Oakman, GM Artisan
Atlantic Shard
Trammelite Merchant
Founder: United Artisans of Britannia

[Lusty]

Thats absolutely correct, I logged in only to go grey about 30 secs after recalling to town. Those damn "vendor buy bank guards" macros got me killed. I got a res from a friend, and started to make kegs for the vendor, since I was grey I wasnt going anywhere. 4 hours later!!! I go blue, the person who had the crate was having a field day with it. Made a lot of kegs that night.

So yeah you can be grey for a very long time if they res kill themselves.

[Lusty]

Something else to be aware of.

Your tinker may go grey at anytime of the day or night for no apparent reason, which can be a pain in the butt.

[DariusOakman]

Well i just did a little test. My tinker made the trap. My mage cast the unlock spell. My mage also was the one who just died from opening it. I logged out right away and logged in with tinker. He was blue and not grey. This I am going to assume means that you can't go grey unless you're online at the time of death.
Not that it matters much. By the way. I'm in Trammel doing this. Again, just for the records.


Darius Oakman, GM Artisan
Atlantic Shard
Trammelite Merchant
Founder: United Artisans of Britannia

[DariusOakman]

Call me short sighted but I don't see much point in these things. Maybe if it was a one useage trap it might be fun but imagine a trap being out in the world of Britannia that can only be stopped if disarmed or destroyed. You may never be able to go to town again. That might be ok if your tinker is a home body but if not, I don't see the point of making them. Some say lootter protection. HA...I'll loot the whole damn crate and make you pay for it by wasting my ass all night long then giving it to a friend and so on. That sound reasonable or am I missing a possibility here?


Darius Oakman, GM Artisan
Atlantic Shard
Trammelite Merchant
Founder: United Artisans of Britannia

[Lusty]

I'll leave it to you, to find alternative uses for them. I will say this though. Some of the biggest laughs I have had in UO is from these things.
People killing themselves from your traps over and over is very rare, and most tire of it very quickly.

I dont even think about thieves anymore, they just arent a problem now. Just a source of amusement.

[DariusOakman]

Well thanks for all the info. I've got some tests to run on this. They'll have to wait til tommorow. Thanks again Lusty.


Darius Oakman, GM Artisan
Atlantic Shard
Trammelite Merchant
Founder: United Artisans of Britannia

[Darik]

I am very close to GM'ing my tinker (93.5) and have a carp of 51. I have another char that is a mage (92). Do I have to gm the mage in order to unlock my trapped crates? If so are there any alternatives? TIA

***Warning Warning Warning***
The Surgeon General has determined that wedding cake greatly decreases a womans sex drive.

[Satyricon]

HAHAH! GM Tinkers will rule the world!
Thanks, Lusty!

[Darik]

BTW, Please make this thread "sticky".
/php-bin/shared/images/icons/doh.gif

***Warning Warning Warning***
The Surgeon General has determined that wedding cake greatly decreases a womans sex drive.

[Traaaknok]

Another one for the records: I just built an explosion and a poison trap. The poison works just fine (bleh..), but the explosion killed my tinker. He was in no guild, trammel, and owner - only thing I can think of right now is that the trap was on the floor, not in his pack. Any help on this?

[Lusty]

In order to make a no damage EXP crate, you have to have to leave the key in the crate. If the key is outside of the crate they will kill you, as they are suposed to......

these only work in trammel, they will kill you in Felucca.
<P ID="edit"><FONT class="small">Edited by Lusty on 08/12/01 11:07 PM.</FONT></P>

[DariusOakman]

Darik, like i said in a previous post : Tinker 82 skill with 80 magery and he coulnd't unlock with a spell. I had to give the crate to my GM mage in order to unlock. You could try lockpicking but again you'd need a high level skill to match your high level tinkering skill. Of course, i'm not the expert here. But it all makes sense.

Darius Oakman, GM Artisan
Atlantic Shard
Trammelite Merchant
Founder: United Artisans of Britannia

[Lusty]

No, just GM the mage, saves all the hassles and questions. It's not as if 100 in magery is hard to do.

I never played with crates before I was GM Tinker, so I really have no info on lower skill levels.

[uo addict]

You state "The Owner will NOT receive a Murder Count if the trap was enabled INSIDE of a house that they OWN/CO-OWN, even if the victim places a Bounty". Yet two lines above you seem to be saying that they won't receive a count in any case. Am I missing something here? Do you need to be in a house you own or not? If not, what is the relevance of the statement above? If you do need to own the house, does being on the same account count?

[Dragoon]

This is the best news since Leather Dye tubs!

Dragoon<font color=blue>(Seige Perilous)</font color=blue>; <a target="_blank" href=http://my.uo.com/cgi-bin/my_chars.pl?52616e646f6d4956ada8052880226f0a4e52c6 c345d55adabaae834ce8ddfbe1c84a0a489b021169b020f72c 5cc9996e>Smythe</a> <font color=blue>(Chessy)</font color=blue>

[DariusOakman]

Just did a wee little test. I have 2 accounts and so i transferred a trapped crate to one of my chars not on my tinker account. Logged tinker out while standing outside of house so that he wouldn't insta-log. Logged in with Kamikazie. Kami grabs crate from inside house (he is a friend of house) and proceeds to experience some rather seering heat. No option was given for him to give a count and my Tinker remained Blue outside of the house. Rez....no changes. I'm on Trammel. If my tinker isn't going to go grey from these......this could be a whole pile of fun.
Or is this just a wet dream? Still testing..........


Darius Oakman, GM Artisan
Atlantic Shard
Trammelite Merchant
Founder: United Artisans of Britannia

[Lusty]

OK, the trap has to be placed on the container whilst you are in your own home, be it your name on the sign or one of your other characters on the same account. You do realise that your 4 other characters are co-owners of house right?

Dont go trying to work out all the variants, just make them in your house, arm them in your house, and use them for yourself, and maybe give some to close friends. If you start up a business selling them, I wish you luck, but it's a mistake, you'll be grey forever. If you screw up and make it outside of your house because you are getting lazy, well you better hope that nobody rez-kills themselves.

[joykiller]

ok posted this as a reply in another post...but since i think its important that as many people see it (especially mods and admins) im posting it here too:

There needs to be a change to the stratics rules now. Yes it should be illegal to discuss exploits here. But this tinker trap question is a clear example of whats wrong with the system here at stratics. Some admin/mod here talked to ONE gm in-game who said its an exploit. Ever since then it was gospel according to all the admins here. Thats ridiculous when other gms say other things...and it turns out that OSI never considered this an exploit. We need a new rule here:

A questionable action must be clearly defined as an exploit by the OSI dev team...not a gm..not somebody who knows a gm...only by a member of the OSI dev team. Unless that happens..the action in question is not an exploit.

What do you all think?

[Lusty]

I PM'd KOFU a few months ago, with a similar guide about crates asking him if I could post it. His reasons for delining my offer were very reasonable.

At that point the only official word from UOSupport to stratics about crates was thats its not acceptable. So KOFU was only going on what information he had received, he also said that as soon as it became clear from UOsupport I could post about it. So I let it lie thinking that UO would never openly admit to the use of them.
If i had bothered to get a transcript from UOSupport and had them forward it to Stratics everything would have been done faster, but I was getting plenty of ICQ's asking me about crates and I figured that the ones that really wanted to know were ICQing me, so I didn't see the need to bother with UOsupport.

So the rules that stratics were following are pretty set in concrete, and it's not just the story from one GM that they go by, they actually do a fair bit of work behind the scenes to find out stuff.

[imported_jamison]

A guide to entertaining uses, from The Mad Bomber of Napa Valley (or rather one of many)

1) Anti-thief. The trapped chest was once called a "snoop-go-boom"
2) Anti-Loot. See "snoop-go-boom"
3) Drop these babies in dungeons near other chests/crates. a lockpicker will eventually come by and KABOOM!
4) (Very old school) Place enough items in the chest/crate to make it too heavy to lift and too many items to put it into your pack. (I like kindleing and feathers because they are free) Drop the chest in a clear area and hide nearby. Someone WILL try to either open or axe the box.
5) Slight variation and requires acting ability. See number 4 but drag the chest about as if you are moving from house to house. nice way to kill "griefers"
6) Not tested but may be possible. Block monsters with trapped chests. They break creates (or once did). See if they do damage.

Other old school tricks.

Trap dungeon chests. (Not sure if it works anymore)
Drop trapped chests onto monsters. Death to looters!
lock a chest down in your house! (lots of fun here)
Build walls of chests in annoying areas. axers like to chop them, thinking they are the work of newbie carpenters.

And as always check the first post before trying this to see where this may or may not be legal.

This has been a small idea list for those who cannot see the joy that has once again been given to us. The mad bomber is back!

<center>http://members.home.net/thewhitetower/sig.jpg

<center>&lt;CrazyJoe&gt; ohman I need some goat porn</center>
<font color=red>Never go gate surfing without regs.</font color=red></center>

[Vesuvius GL]

The continuously going grey issue should not be a problem, for the fact that in my chaos guild if we get one 90% of the time we pickup an axe and kamikaze to gwt whats inside, most people have better things to do than blow up traps all night.

"When life gives you lemons, squeeze the juice into a water pistol and shoot people in the eyes"

[Attorneyman]

Obviously you don't run a shop on Trammel.

[Lusty]

You're right, but I dont understand your point either way.

[Arlis]

How about this?

Make your GM tinker trapped chests but Disarm them
then place on a vendor with the key inside and a book explaining that they must lock them to use. now you wont have to worry about being gray because the buyer would be the last person to arm it.
also you could add another book (or two) explaining how to unlock them but leave them armed.
I never tried this (only 90 tinker) but I think it would work.
could someone test it or let me know if that works.
thanks

Arlis, Grandmaster Smith/Miner/Fisherman
Catskills Shard

[Traaaknok]

Ah.. thanks a lot... and those are way too practical with a lot of guildwars in trammel :)

[Lusty]

<center><font color=red>The Fabled Insta Death Crates</font color=red></center>

Damage Information:(Based on GM Tinker)

<font color=green>Poison</font color=green> traps will kill its victim 99.99% of the time.

<font color=red>Explosion</font color=red> traps will deal 40-180 HP Damage.

<font color=blue>Dart</font color=blue> traps will do Max Damage of 80 HP.


Testing Methods:

<font color=green>Poison</font color=green>: Magery cannot cure this poison, period. If you are a mage and get a dose of lethal, you're dead, end of story. Don't waste your time and reagents, recall to a shrine. From todays testing I found that Lethal can be cured, and pretty reliably as it turns out. My character with 94.2/93.2 displayed/real healing, and 100 Anatomy was able to cure pretty well. Out of 5 doses of Lethal from a crate I only lost the player once. Which was from failing 4 times in a row. I doubt you will have time to cure yourself though which is good for tinkers. Bandages taking about 11 seconds to apply with high dex. So there you go it can be done, but your healer has to be on the ball.

<font color=red>Explosions</font color=red>: I used Bless items to raise my strength from 100 to 200 and a greater strength potion for this, total of 220 HP was attained. More often than not it was 100+ HP damage, but Explosions are not a sure fire thing for an outright kill. You may also get freak explosions that do 180 HP but they are rare.

<font color=blue>Darts</font color=blue>: I use dart traps to train healing, 20HP<=Damage<=80HP

Tinker traps will reset forever, or until the Remove Trap skill is used successfully on it. This is because errr... you successfully remove the trap. Duh.

Strength of Traps: Using higher strength potions have nothing do to with strength of traps, personally I use Greater Explosions only because thats what I have lying about, for poisons I use lesser as they are cheap to make, store bought would do just as well I would imagine.


Ownership and Responsibility for Deaths: UPDATED 26/09/2001


"Damage from a trap will not cause the maker of the trap to be a candidate for a murder count, unless the maker is also the controller. Thus, if you are the maker and are the last one to set the trap, you can get a murder count if your trap kills someone." This was taken from the uo.com pages, and it's wrong, test it for yourself, and make up your own minds. My tinker has always created and enabled his own traps, he is also still blue.

"The controller is defined as the last person to set the trap. If you make a trap, and give it to another player who sets the trap, that player is the controller. Again, if someone dies to a tinker trapped box, only the controller of that box is eligible for a murder count."

Bold entries are straight from custhelp.uo.com

The last sentence seems to indicicate that the the controller(the person that enables the trap), can be liable for a count.
This is also Incorrect, they seem to contradict themselves in the same paragraph. Stating earlier that you can only be liable for a count if you are the maker and controller. The only thing I can say for sure is that none of my non-tinker characters have ever gotten a count for using a crate.


If your trap kills someone you are responsible, with criminal not murderous consequences. The Owner (tinker) will be attackable by the Guards for about 30 seconds after the death of the victim, and you will go grey for the standard amount of time. You may or may not go grey depending on who you ask, I go grey a lot, I also get guard whacked on occasion. Others say that they have never been grey or guard whacked. The victim may get the option to report the owner for murder, however no count will be transfered, even if the victim places a Bounty. I have personally reported my tinker a few times when I accidently miss a rune book and d/click the crate. It's a spite thing for my own stupidity. I cannot stress this enough, YOU MUST CREATE AND ARM TRAPS INSIDE OF YOUR HOUSE. Again depends on who you ask, but this would have to be the safest way.


20/10/01 While macroing away inside my house, I had already been at it for some 4 hours making kegs for my vendor, when all the sudden I get the following happen to me, so for those that say you wont go grey from tinker traps, don't say I didn't warn you. I haven't made any crates in great numbers for months, the ones I have made were for personal use and I havent lost any of those. So this crate would be at least 4-6 weeks old. Didn't get a count though and that's always nice /php-bin/shared/images/icons/biggrin.gif

<center>http://members.dingoblue.net.au/~povertystriken/guards.jpg</center>

Things that have a lot more relavance now.

Your tinker may very well go grey at any given time day or night, also if the person getting killed by your trap chooses to res-kill themselves, (thinking that they are giving you counts), you could be grey for a very long time. Some people say that they have never gone grey, all I can say is that I have been. I suggest you play around and find out for yourselves, try everything.

"Vendor Buy Bank Guards Recdu Recsu Stable" macros are extremely irritating and anyone using them should be instantly and permanently banned, they are also dangerous for a grey tinker inside of towns. This macro will get you guard whacked should one of your traps kill someone at the wrong time. PK'ing people that use these macros should not be criminal. If I was in town when the above picture was taken and someone had spammed the above macro in the 30 secs I was "attackable by guards", I wouldve gotten whacked.


Creation:

All crates follow the same creation procedure.

1) Make a lockable wooden crate (any size), using the Carpentry skill. Not Chests, not armoires, not little red boxes, only crates.

2) Trap it with your desired style of trap, using the Tinkering skill. (any style)

3) Turn it 90 degrees any way you can, either by positioning it on the floor, or lock it down and use the decor tool. (Large crates can only be turned by the decor tool)

4) Unlock it with 3rd circle spell "Unlock". (At GM Tinker skill, you will require a GM Mage to cast the spell, lower level mages just don't have the *power* in spell casting. Even at lower Tinker levels you may still require a GM Mage.)


Ways to set off the trap:

UOA's count resourse option. Damages you.
UOA's auto open new containers. Damages you.
Trying to pick. Damages picker.
D/clicking. Damages person trying to view contents.
Axe. Damages weilder of axe.


Starting out:

I suggest you experiment with dart traps to begin with, until you are comfortable with the creation and use of the crates, darts generally won't kill you in one hit. Explosion and Poison tinker traps are more deadly than a GM Lumberjacking Balron with a Vanquishing Axe on cable. :)
You can use crates or any other container along with UOA to make an "undress bag" or "disarm bag", useful for storing your stuff in till you can bank it.


Losing resource counts:

Crossing a server line on foot or by boat can mess up your resources count, and dying or dropping the crate from your pack will certainly do it. This will happen to you eventually, and it can be a pain in the butt. Doesn't have to be that way though.

Stackable items, such as reagents and bandages are easily fixed by adding a few of each type to the crate this will reveal the full amount. (Bandies must be exact same colour.)

Potions on the other hand are best carried outside of your trapped crate. It's a desperate thief that has to clear a perma from stealing a potion. If I may generalise about thieves, most seem to be after things of value, weapons/novelties/rares, and little trinkets that are more of an annoyance to be without.

If you have lost resources, it's not the end of the world. You can still cast spells even though your count says you have none available, it just finds them somehow. Potions and bandages it wont.

If you absoutely have to get your stuff out of a trap, do it at a shrine. There are other ways, (aren't there always), and you should try to find out that yourself rather than have everything delivered to you on a silver platter.

"The owner of the chest can access the chest automatically without firing the trap. The owner is defined as the last person to lock the chest."
This is not entirely correct, my tinker can make and arm and then die to his own traps if he does not have the keys on him.
You can however turn them out of Insta mode and have your tinker access the contents without the trap firing. (Tested and proven, credit to Crimer)


Playing within the rules:

Don't PK with them in Trammel! It has taken years, much debate and frustration to get an answer on the legality of them, don't screw it up for the rest of us by generating support calls.

Try to be a little discerning in who you supply your crates to. If your customer uses them in Trammel to kill other players, chances are you will get a visit from a GM next time you log in your Tinker. You may have to explain yourself.


Stuff to consider:


The 3rd Circle spell Telekinesis will tell you what sort of trap it is if you have forgotten, or have made a bulk amount of different types, remember to do this from a safe distance.

Explosion traps that you are the owner of will do no damage to you in Trammel, (great for unlimited Para busters.) Although they will kill you if you forget and use them in Felucca. You must have the key for the crate inside the crate. Experiment with this one, doesn't always work. Once you have a crate that does no damage to you, keep it. Make insta Exp crate while unlocked drop key in it. Do it at the healers just incase it doesn't work he first time.


Some quirks with large crates:

You will notice that the only difference is the way the timber joins run, it's not obvious which way they face, which is a good thing.

Another good thing about large crates is that after you use the decor tool, they stay the way they are supposed to be facing even when you drop them on the ground. Small and medium crates are prone to turn about when dropping them, putting them out of insta mode.

You cannot get an item count from large crates while facing in the insta mode direction. Small and medium you do. Theres a tip.<P ID="edit"><FONT class="small">Edited by Lusty on 10/19/01 06:05 PM.</FONT></P>

[Traaaknok]

On two of those ideas:

Blockmonstergoboom: Works not.... The bridge leading from ogre lord island to the main part of the dungeon is only two tiles wide, and was blocked expertly by my tinker (okok.. screaming and running around like a chicken, but i managed to block it) -&gt; Monsters break trapped chests, are not affected by the content, though. Explosion and poison traps tested - neither worked (bah!).

On killing lockpickers: It works (unfortunately, got killed by that once), but once it has worked it shouldn't happen again. Player made chests highlight, whereas normal dunegon chests do not. If something highlights - ignore.

[Pfredd]

This thread is now sticky, for the time being.

Lusty, if you would like to put together a cleaned up version of this for the FAQ, please PM me.


Pfredd Mudd
UOSS News Manager
Moderator of UO Carpentry & UO Tinkering

[Lusty]

I'm on it !!!

[mawood]

My tinker has NEVER went grey. Been making these for many months. No counts, no greys - never. I use them, sell them and leave them laying around, nothing.

Gryzzly Addamz, Great Lakes
http://www.ccs-s.com/sigg.gif
WARRIOR FLASH SIG http://www.twistedclicks.com/abba.html (http://www.ccs-s.com/uosig.html>http://www.ccs-s.com/uosig.html</a>
AWESOME)

[Lusty]

I know man, we've spoken about this before. I'm pretty damn sure we do everything exactly the same way. There must be one variable that we do differently. Just can't find what it is.
I believe you when you say that you've never been grey. I just wish I knew what happened there for a few days when I was grey almost all the time.
Maybe I stuffed up and relocked one outside of the house, I dont know.
Hasnt happened lately though, I've been a lot more careful after making one for a guy in a town and taking 2 counts on it.

[Crimer]

I love the poison traps the best, watching your victim lothe in his few last breathes before he dies; there is no greater feeling. I make explosion occasionally, but they are inconsisent in performing their duty; killing the snooper.

My tinker is mainly a house rat, but I've recently been sending him out and about in the real world as he works his journey toward GM Magery so he can unlock his own crates (97.3 now =) I have yet to turn grey and snoopers have died on the spot in my presence. To my knowledge, I have only killed using poison traps.

I only use small crates. I make, trap and lock them in my pouch/backpack, place them north/south on the floor in my house and have a GM mage unlock them. I then enable them by facing them east/west. I've noticed that the person with the key to the crate can open it in the north/south position without the trap going off, but a person without the key cannot, but the trap still doesn't go off.

Happy Hunting

[DariusOakman]

Crimer, I can confirm these same results.


Darius Oakman, GM Artisan
Atlantic Shard
Trammelite Merchant
Founder: United Artisans of Britannia

[Crimer]

I made a character on a test shard with GM carpenter, GM tinker, GM Magery, GM Lockpicking, GM Detect Hidden, and GM Remove Trap.

Even at GM lockpicking, I was unsuccessful in ever picking the lock of any of my GM tinker trapped items without them exploding in my face. Try it out for yourself on the test shard in one on many Trammel healer huts (as you will die often). If anyone has had different luck, I'd like to hear.

As far as using the Remove Trap skill, I believe you first have to successfully identify the trap using detect hidden. Otherwise you have a chance of failing. I didn't play around too much with this as I don't know anyone with GM Detect Hidden/GM Remove Trap anyway. However it makes sense and is similar to a blacksmith not using arms lore before repairing the item. A GM blacksmith has a chance of breaking a piece in critical need of repair if he doesn't use arms lore before repairing it.

[Crimer]

On the FAQ, it states that you MUST be in your house.

On the test shard using my method of making, trapping and locking the items in my backpack, then putting the trapped item on the ground (anywhere) in the north/south position, casting magic unlock and then placing the crate east/west, I took no murder counts, never went grey and even PKed a few people in Trammel cities (funny watching them and there are no GMs on the test shards).

I know I don't own a house on the test shard so I sense a little discrepancy here.

[Lusty]

Test shards are not a reliable place to test things (LOL as stupid as that sounds), they differ so wildly from production shards.
Ok ill go make one outside of the house and see what happens.

[Cinny]

God knows how many trapped boxes ive made in the past year and sold on my vendors for people to practice DH on.. ok now if those are still in existance and people use em like this, do i go grey? :)
just wondering

Cinnamon, Town Cook Of Nidaros
<a target="_blank" href=http://nidaros.chessienet.com>http://nidaros.chessienet.com</a>

[Lusty]

Here's a few different ways you might like to think about.


Creation Location
inside guards
outside guards
Inside Owned House
Inside Co-owned house
Inside Friended House
Inside Stranger to House
Trammel
Felucca

Trapped Location
In pack
On Floor/ground
inside guards
outside guards
Inside Owned House
Inside Co-owned house
Inside Friended House
Inside Stranger to House
Trammel
Felucca

Armed Location
In pack
On Floor/ground
inside guards
outside guards
Inside Owned House
Inside Co-owned house
Inside Friended House
Inside Stranger to House
Trammel
Felucca

Quite a few different permutations to these as you can see, guess we better get cracking.

I wouls suggest though that he only ones that would really matter, would be the trapped and armed locations. By armed I mean locked. Maybe facet, who really knows? Creating a just lockable crate though, would surprise me greatly if there was any sort of flagging on the creator.


Oh and another thing, you know how it goes "this container is locked but since you are the owner you can open it"? Maybe thats the owner flagging, for crim status? If you still have the key on you?
<P ID="edit"><FONT class="small">Edited by Lusty on 08/14/01 03:49 AM.</FONT></P>

[mawood]

One thing that cannot be denied, this is fun. I love making a few to carry at once, that way, when I know I am being snooped, I tell them one is not trapped - feel lucky? They often die and come back to try another, and another, eventually finding all trapped. "Woops, I guess I lied." Ironically, its my thief that carries them. So when I find these boxes on others, they mostly forget to weigh them down, and yoink - I take the whole crate. A good tactic is to have two crates and cover one up with a death robe. They think thats the one to see - Ssssss, sorry :). Also, use explosion at moongates and poison anywhere else. All too often, the poisoned victim will run into the gate and you'll miss out on your loot. My tests with gm tinker explosion crates did from 89-119 damage. And leave one in your home - I come home often to dead people nosing around. The best part - dieing, getting looted, ssssssss, looter is ghost too. Who said ghosts can't kill?

See my tinker flash below? Don't do that - you may suddenly become non-existent.

Gryzzly Addamz, Great Lakes
http://www.ccs-s.com/sigg.gif
WARRIOR FLASH SIG http://www.twistedclicks.com/abba.html (http://www.ccs-s.com/uosig.html>http://www.ccs-s.com/uosig.html</a>
AWESOME)

[flow]

sorry... i still have a couple of questions.

1. can you get things out of the crate once you trap and unlock it? every time i try to open it, i die ;)

2. i can't get the para buster thing to work. the key's in the crate, but i still die. i'm in trammel, but i'm guilded (to the tinker too). i'm assuming that's the problem.

i'm not too worried about the para buster, but it would be nice to be able to put things in *and* get them out. someone suggested putting it in the bank and trying. when the grain was going n/s, i couldn't open it at all (normal). when it was facing e/w, i had to make a quick run to the healer. :)

is it possible to get things out of the crate?

[Lusty]

*ahem* If you still have the key for the crate, use it to disarm the trap. LOL Then go thru the process of arming again.

Try this for the para buster, get your tinker to make the crate, trap the crate in his pack, and lock/arm the crate while the key is still inside crate. Dont know about the guilded thing, they may very well have something to do with it.


*edit*
actually no the guilded thing shouldnt have anything to do with it, I just remembered that I joined a guild with the tinker a little while ago.
<P ID="edit"><FONT class="small">Edited by Lusty on 08/14/01 09:02 PM.</FONT></P>

[flow]

hehe... yeah, i know i could re-arm it, but i don't have a gm mage, so i have to bug my friends every time i want to. i was just wondering if there was another way.

i'll try arming it while the key is still in there. i was just putting it in after arming it before.

thanks for the reply.

[Lusty]

You can if you are really desperate. With poisons you have about 15-20 secs @100 HP to get as much of it out as you can. Res + repeat until its all out. With exp you have to open it and hope its a dud firing, and doesn't kill you. If it does kill you, res, bless, heal up and try again. Other than that, no not really, the idea is that nobody has access to the contents, unfortunately you included.

[Lusty]

&lt;------------- new title yippee

[flow]

insta death crates do wonderous things... ;)

[Tim Dunkin Dunca]

just got my trapped chest working!

no count option, no turning grey!

Prince of Verona
<a target="_blank" href=http://www.tetris.com> The game of Champions</a>
<center>http://soulbane.homestead.com/files/Patch12.jpg</center>

[SpidahQuee]

Lusty..................... I love you
Thank you for your time and effort spent on the information you have greatly provided.


Beholdah, Stackfoldah, Gun Holdah, a.k.a. Bluntrollah...

[SpidahQuee]

One more thing. if you originally armed the crate outside of house, but rethink and take it back to house and re-arm it the proper way. Are you count free?
plus once i magic unlock it wont go boom unless i rotate it 90 degrees, but once rotated i am also in danger if i accidently open it. is that correct? so making the box/crate snoopable endangers me if im stupid and open it..

Beholdah, Stackfoldah, Gun Holdah, a.k.a. Bluntrollah...

[Lusty]

There are so many permutations to making them that I can't possibly be expected to do them all.

If you make a crate that gives interesting, unusual or reliable results, post it. That way we can get some conformations and I can add it.

Please be sure to include the exact location and exact steps that you did in creating the trap.

I am getting many ICQ's with just as many varying results.

[Darik]

Lusty you are THE BEST!!! /php-bin/shared/images/icons/biggrin.gif

I finally gm'd my mage and was able to try this out, and it works perfectly. I am going to have sooooooo much fun with this! /php-bin/shared/images/icons/sgrin.gif

Many thanks!!! now i'm off to battle /php-bin/shared/images/icons/army.gif

***Warning Warning Warning***
The Surgeon General has determined that wedding cake greatly decreases a womans sex drive.

[Crimer]

The joy of tinker traps. Now you know how to make them, but people still often wonder how you can get stuff out of them after they are in their extremely dangerous configuration. I've done some experimentations and here are a few basic ways:

1) UOA Arm/Disarm. If you select the appropriate weapon and your trapped crate as your disarm pack, you will successfully be able to arm and disarm your weapon to the crate.

2) UOA Dress. If you save what is currently being worn using UOA and stick any of those items in the crate, you can successfully get them out using the dress key.

3) You are always able to use regs from a unlocked, but trapped crate.

You can see that as long as you have a key to get the item back out of the crate without having to double-click the crate itself, you can get just about any item out you want.

4) But you want more...

Ah, well I have not gotten this formula to work 100% of the time yet, but it DOES work and is by far the BEST method:

Have you ever noticed that your Tinker can always seem to open his unlocked, trapped crates in their north/south position even though they are trapped? Have you also noticed that NO ONE else can? Well based on a few practice runs, I made a trapped crate in the usual fashion with my tinker and then gave it to my character I wanted to use it with, had that character enable the trap and then have my Tinker/Mage cast magic unlock on it. Amazingly my Tinker can no longer open the crate in the north/south position. But now my other character CAN!!

So what does this mean?

You now have a crate in your backpack that CANNOT be opened by snoopers in the north/south position. If you want, you can place the crate in the east/west position to enable the trap, but why bother? You can't access the items either.

Here's how to have a little fun with this:

1) Make three trapped crates. You only need one that your character can open in the north/south position.
2) Put all your usable items that you normally carry around in the openable crate.
3) Weigh the other two crates with enough stones to make them unstealable.
4) Place the openable crate in the north/south position in the middle of your backpack.
5) Place the other two crates in the east/west position, one on each side of the openable crate. Although I am partial to poison, I like to have one explosion and one poison to mix things up a little.

Now you can safely walk around anywhere without having to worry about snoopers or items being stolen from you (well as long as you don't get PKed)
** This DOES NOT work for STEAL LAST TARGET so beware!

Now for the fun:

6) Locate a thief.
7) Snoop him.
8) Usually he will snoop you back in retaliation.
9) BOOM - Another thief bites the dust

Have Fun

[Crimer]

Place an Explosion Trap crate inside a Poison Trap crate. They snoop the poison still got a few seconds to live, snoop the next - BOOM. Nasty combo.

[Arlis]

Crimer I tried your suggestions.
Oh man is that fun! I've never laughed so hard in 3 years of playing UO
GMing tinkering just for the entertainment value was well worth it.

oh and like the poster above me I do the same thing, Poison with and explosion inside.

Try this out at any Player-run events.
A little game I call KABOOM!
set up a booth
offer to everyone the chance to win 500 gold for only 250 entry fee.
take 2 trapped boxes and 1 untrapped
take 3 books name 2 books "you lose" and one "You WIN"
now set up the 3 chest side-by-side in any order and have the player open one.
if they open the right one you pay them 500 gold, if not they dead and you are 250 gold richer. It is lots of fun people love playing this game.
on catskills I watched about 15 people die and only one win the last time I tried it.

Arlis, Grandmaster Smith/Miner/Fisherman
Catskills Shard

[Dragoon]

You are correct that having a high lockpick skill will not get you into a trapped chest.

You do not however, have to use Detect on a trap before using Remove skill. It makes no difference if you do except that you know that the trap is there. However, if you are using a 90 something Remove Trap skill on a trap done by a GM Tinker, you will lose more often than not. And, there are WAY more GM Tinkers than GM Remove Trap players on a real shard.

Dragoon<font color=blue>(Seige Perilous)</font color=blue>; <a target="_blank" href=http://my.uo.com/cgi-bin/my_chars.pl?52616e646f6d4956ada8052880226f0a4e52c6 c345d55adabaae834ce8ddfbe1c84a0a489b021169b020f72c 5cc9996e>Smythe</a> <font color=blue>(Chessy)</font color=blue>

[smeee]

i'm working on being one of the few remove trap gm's (95.5 now) and tinkerer traps are deffinetly fun./php-bin/shared/images/icons/smile.gif

The answer To the Question of Life, The universe, and everything, is 42.

[Dragoon]

I don't have a GM Mage and was unable to use magic unlock with my 90 something mage. I do have a GM Detect/GM Remove with 98.2 Lockpicking on Chessy. I made a trapped chest with my GM Tinker character and used my Detect/Remove/Lockpicking character to unlock and set the insta-explode. It worked great. This was all done in a house owned by both characters on the same account. The unlocking was done while the chest sat on the floor. Perhaps this had something to do with the differences in our results.

Dragoon<font color=blue>(Seige Perilous)</font color=blue>; <a target="_blank" href=http://my.uo.com/cgi-bin/my_chars.pl?52616e646f6d4956ada8052880226f0a4e52c6 c345d55adabaae834ce8ddfbe1c84a0a489b021169b020f72c 5cc9996e>Smythe</a> <font color=blue>(Chessy)</font color=blue>

[Dragoon]

When you GM Remove Trap, go join factions. You'll clean up. Unless you are on Chessy where I already own the place /php-bin/shared/images/icons/biggrin.gif

Dragoon<font color=blue>(Seige Perilous)</font color=blue>; <a target="_blank" href=http://my.uo.com/cgi-bin/my_chars.pl?52616e646f6d4956ada8052880226f0a4e52c6 c345d55adabaae834ce8ddfbe1c84a0a489b021169b020f72c 5cc9996e>Smythe</a> <font color=blue>(Chessy)</font color=blue>

[Grommit]

<blockquote><hr>


Damage Information:(Based on GM Tinker)

Poison traps will kill its victim 99.99% of the time.

Explosion traps will deal 40-180 HP Damage.

Dart traps will do Max Damage of 80 HP.


<hr></blockquote>

I've been working my remove trap a lot recently and occasionally my dart traps will do more than 80 hp of damage. The highest I've seen is 86. This may be due to the recent hit point calculation changes or it may not be. Has anybody else seen this behaviour in dart traps?


-------
Don't feel bad and don't feel special, I discriminate against just about everybody if I can help it. :)

[Lusty]

Well... In an effort to see if I could duplicate your results, I did a little healing 8x8 macroing today. I'm dissapointed that I could not reproduce your results. When I said 20-80, thats not entirely correct, I never actually got a 20 HP and never actually got an 80 either. I did however get 23's and 79's, so for the sake of neatness I just made it a little outside of those values.

On a 3 AR character today I went about seriously recording what I did get hit for, here it is.

20-29 HP (32 Times)
30-39 HP (36 Times)
40-49 HP (42 Times)
50-59 HP (49 Times)
60-69 HP (32 Times)
70-79 HP (26 Times)

So out of 197 recorded trap springs I never got an 80 nor did I get a &lt;20

BTW I gained 12.7 healing, 90.3 real now :))

Well....Just found an old screenshot...It was unfortunatly ruined, but I managed to get the journal text off of it...

Little bit of history on it,
I was wandering around in Delucia fel one day when I see a pair of tamers just romping around...One is a Glo-lord the other is a Illus-lady...

I was gathering leather, so I was killing bulls...they went through the regular tamer routine about bulls...

So I log in Guybrush, my beloved thief.

I stole a bunch of junk from them, couple keyrings etc...

Eventually they tried to kill me and failed...the moment I had been waiting for...

I went to the bank and grabbed my LP trapped box, banked all my gear and set about my evil deed...I just meandered in and stole a potion or some other small item, the both attack me. The illus lady loots my box and takes the bait hook line and sinker, she dies after a few pitiful attempts to cure.

Now, here's where I have the journal...

Brandy: ||| F * C K
fern: Rel Por
Guybrush: Like the box?
Guybrush: =P
Brandy: off
Guybrush: (Lost line)
Guybrush: lol
You see: Lord fern
Being perfectly rested, you shove them out of the way.
You see: a cow
You see: a cow
You see: a rabbit
You see: a goat
You see: a bull
Guybrush: I can't reach that
You see: A corpse of Guybrush
Brandy: prick
(Rest garbled, was "fern" asking me to leave her alone...I explained that I had done nothing but steal, and explained that she committed suicide...they weren't very happy with my answers and left.)

<center>http://shivall.homestead.com/files/statloss.jpg
I LOVE UO:R THANK YOU OSI!!111</center>

[Rich IX]

How come I got a count ?


<center>http://www.slipknot1.com/main/logo-main.gif
</center>

[Dewey Chethem]

i gmd tinkering a few weeks ago and have had enormous fun killing people with boxes. today as i was nearing the 100 mark of people killed i received my first count.. yes i have been making then correctly (in my house) and am a lil stumped as to how i received a murder count... the character i was using does not pvp or attack people in any way so im wondering how this was possible...

[Dewey Chethem]

i figured i would explain how i made a crate that gave me a count. i made this crate the same way i have made every crate i ever made, and never got a count with one until today.
i trapped and locked the crate in my fel house while it was in my pack (my house is not in guard protect). then i placed it on the ground inside my house inna east/west direction and casted unlock on it. my question is this to any who would know. should i wait until the crate is on the ground to lock it? i dont understand how i received a count when i never have before using this method.
also the grey flagging issue i think i have pegged. i was droppin crates at bucs den when someone gated one out to brit bank. well 2 min later i get the message 'guards can now be called on u' of course i get attacked by 5 people but manage to get inna moongate. i waited til blue then went to brit bank to see the guys corpse next to my crate. so im not sure this is it but i think it is.. u flag grey when the crate is opened in guard protect areas. lusty plz respond to this

[Lusty]

Found something out today, its reflected in the ownership bit.

[Lusty]

In my entire career the Tinker (Blacky) has gotten 2 counts from crates, both within minutes of each other. Now I have no friggin idea what does it, sorry I just don't know. I have made literally 500+ crates, all of which have been used. Either they were looted off my corpse, taken away by other people or hit with an axe. In that whole lot I got 2 counts, who knows why. It's more than likely a bug.

As for where they are unlocked. Since Blacky dropped to 90.1 magery, some 6 months ago, he hasn't been able to open his own crates, so they are always done on the floor of my house, always!
Something else that bothers me about the info I found today at UOcusthelp, is that Blacky always traps and arms the crates, always the same. It's a routine, it never changes. So personally I think that info is wrong.

When I do a crate run it goes like this.
Make 20 crates, all with keys in them.
Stack them neatly into piles on the floor 5 high.
Trap each one.
Make a keyring to hold all the keys.
Put all the keys on the keyring. I only use a keyring for convienience.
Enable all the traps.
Lock all the crates down.
Use the decor tool to turn them all about. Throw the key ring in a secure.
Log out the tinker and in with a Gm mage.
Have the mage unlock all of them, and release all of them, then store in a secure.

I do it the same way every time.

I like your theory on flagging, but I havent been using crates much lately. I have a full secure of them, and haven't been PvPing much at all, so Ive lost very few of them. Can you get together with a mate and do some recording. EXP seem to be the ones that make me go grey, poison I havent noticed.

[Widowmaker]

Fantastic info there Lusty , thanks heaps..

http://users.bigpond.net.au/bencat/froggysig.jpg

[Valmont VonSerma]

Maybe a little other back-ground info.

At one time you were able to make Insta-Death Crates without using a GM mage. This was done (if I remember this correctly) make a crate, trap it with your choice of trap, set the crate down on the ground faceing n/s, lock the crate to enable the trap, then put the key on a keyring, turn crate to faceing e/w, un-lock the crate, anyone that opens the sets if off, this was still effected by what way the crate was facing when it was opened. n/s the last person to lock the crate could open it with or without the key and no one else could. e/w anyone who opened it set off the trap with or without the key. (Don't know if this still works or not, I'll try it sometime in the next few day and post a reply)

I use to do this all the time in Fel and also never set the traps up inside of my house. I also only used the small crates. My tinker never turned grey or got a count from a crate that he made. I also only used them at banks or while I was mining in Minoc Mines so I was usally in a guarded area. (I'll also try this as well and let you guys know)

And just so everyone knows.... here is OSI's decision on tinker traps again. (I don't want to see a fellow tinker get banned for doing this wrongly)

It is legal to trap a chest as you describe. I will not give out details on how to make these, nor will a GM in game.

However, it is illegal to use these to kill someone in Trammel, unless you have highlighting with them. Otherwise, you are pking someone in Trammel, which is a clear rule violation.

So:
It is legal to carry these in Felucca.
It is legal to carry these in Trammel.
It is legal to set these on the ground in Felucca with the intent of killing a curious person.
It is illegal to set these on the ground with the intent of killing someone on Trammel.
It is legal if the looter on Felucca is killed by looting your corpse and opening the chest.
It is illegal to use one for the clear purpose of killing a looter on Trammel. If you are minding your own business and you die, that's okay. It becomes illegal if the support team recognizes that your character just "happens" to die with trapped chests on them all the time. I don't want players making kamikaze newbies that carry around trapped chests and die just so they can blow looters up. I hope the distinction for this one is clear. We're looking at intent as much as outcome.
(All I can say about this last one is, if my character doesn't turn grey or get a count he is always going to have it on him, Tram or Fel)

[Lusty]

Yeah, I'm not concerned about having them on characters that have them in the pack in Trammel. None of my characters leave the house without having regs in a crate. Like your post reflects, the intent is what matters when people die in Trammel due to crates.

If you are attacking guards outside brit Bank to flag grey and also get whacked while you are loaded to the eyeballs with insta crates and many a banksitter dies, then that's more than likely the intent they are talking about. If you should die in a Trammel dungeon and you dont happen to make it back on time and your looter gets killed, I see that as acceptable, so long as you are not doing it intentionally. IF you die from gameplay, then thats fine. Most looters aren't the ones that dont know about the crates anyway.



"Presenting the information in a format that belies a certain benevolence on the part of the writer."

[tsalin]

I was at Trammel Britain forge two days ago (10-29-01) and someone put a red box down on the ground and said "open this please". I opened it, was poisoned, died, then got a murder count screen. I gave someone a murder count; I can't recall if it was a different name than the person who put the crate on the ground or not, but I did give a murder count to someone.

PS: the person who put the crate on the ground did not turn grey, and after thinking about it, I am pretty sure the person I gave a murder to was NOT the person who put the box on the ground.
<P ID="edit"><FONT class="small">Edited by Tsalin on 10/31/01 08:42 PM.</FONT></P>

[OldSalty]

Have poison traps been nerfed? The lvl 5 poison is now curable with magery!

[Oronicus]

Help!!!!

93 Tinkering. Trying to place poison trap on small, medium, larege crate.

Message "You cannot place a trap on that"

wtf

thanks

check the orientation of the crate
rotate it if you cant place trap on it
its a strange bug but its there

[mawood]

Na, I am killing MANY still. I have seen numerous failures in an attempt to cure it with magery. Ironically, my thief carries these as thief protection. :-) Sold/lost over a thousand and still no counts.

Gryzzly Addamz, Great Lakes
http://www.ccs-s.com/kk2.gif
WARRIOR FLASH SIG http://www.twistedclicks.com/abba.html (http://www.ccs-s.com/uosig.html>http://www.ccs-s.com/uosig.html</a>
AWESOME)

I'm still making traps according to Lusty's method. The explosion ones seem variable; sometimes kill / sometimes nearly kill (both per trigger & per box). The poison ones kill me in under 10 seconds, have yet to be cured by magery (certainly not mine) but have been cured on average 4 out of 5 tries by a bandie healer of around 86 skill standing at the ready next to me. Er, that's 4 out of 5 triggers. He had a few attempts per poisoning.

http://imp.uow.edu.au/staff/fink/uo/sig_doc.jpg
<P ID="edit"><FONT class="small">Edited by Fink on 12/26/01 07:33 AM.</FONT></P>

[BobtheArchmage]

i tink a lot :/

[SirWillow]

GM magery is now able to cure the poison, as I've seen from observation of a few different instances. However it's still a rare shot, and the person has to be quick with it. Seems to cure about one time in 4 or 5. But they can't waste any time at all with it.

I do have one question on legality that I don't see mentioned- is it legal to have one set up in your house in Tram so that it kills anyone looking at it? I'm thinking of setting one up with a bone container next to or on top of it, with another one in the bone container. Legal when someone dies or no?

And reagents are fully usuable from a trapped container, as well as it being able to be used as an arm/disarm bag?

Thanks for the clarifications.

[TheMan_inBlack]

These things so rool. ~_~

[DimiGR]

i have the folowing problem:

a) made the crates with the tinker
b) traped them
c) left them in a secure box
d) changed chars and loged in with my mage
e) locked it down and turn it once with the deco tool
f) Picked it up in my inv and unlock it with unlock and re-enebled the trap leaving the key in the crate

The crate damages my mage. I thought that the last person who enables the trap will be the owner. Isnt that correct? what i am doing wrong? Does it matters that i am in a guild?

thx in advance

just made some for fun today and yes the poison ones can b cured. took bout 5 tries (that gm tinker/carp trapped box) and the greater boom box did 174 damage wow. i was dead before i knew it. wow

[Moff Tarkin]

/php-bin/shared/images/icons/evileye.gif

.....and the "Resurrecting an Ancient Thread" award goes to.... carpenterdan!

/php-bin/shared/images/icons/biggrin.gif

You might have been a little premature, though. Only 2 more weeks and it would have been exactly a year since the last post.

[GNecromancer]

Is Carpenty a must???
Can you buy a lockable crate or does it have to be made?
and does turining it 90 dagrees toggle the trap to work?

[Moff Tarkin]

You either need to be a Carpenter or know one, although it doesn't really take much skill to make a locking crate.