Poll: Power Hour changes! [Archive]

09-10-2001, 04:46 PM

This is how Power Hour is going to work:
<blockquote><hr>

To resolve this issue, power hour will now be calculated based on the players’ play time, rather than the shards’ local time.

Players will experience a power hour during their first hour of play a character within a 24 hour period, which means that technically, the power hour will be refreshed 23 hours after the previous power hour has ended. If a player does not log in for over 24 hours, their power hour will begin as soon as they log in, and last for the full hour.

As an example, a player who logs in at 8:00 PM local time will experience a power hour that will last until 9:00 PM. They will not be able to experience another power hour during that 24 hour period, so they will not receive another power hour until at least 8:00 PM the following day. If they do not log in again until 10:00 PM, they will experience their full power hour, beginning at 10:00 PM and lasting until 11:00 PM. The following day, they will not be able to experience a power hour until at least 10:00 PM local time.

<hr></blockquote>

 Take Care 
 Zayin 
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09-10-2001, 04:58 PM

If you log in at 8 as you say, and don't complete the PH. Let's say log off at 8:30. It still resets at 8 the next day...correct? Is the remaining 30 minutes lost or can you log back in later to complete that time? If so, does the PH timer now go from the time you actually finished 1 hour of being online with that character?
I'm glad this system is easier than 12 midnight.....sheeeeeeeeeesh!

--------------------
Stress: The confusion created when one's mind overrides the body's basic desire to choke the living crap out of some bunghole who desperately deserves it.

09-10-2001, 05:28 PM

Im sorry i have to coment on this.

THIS IS THE DUMBEST THING I HAVE EVER HEARD OF AND I ABSOLUTLY HATE IT.

What the hell kind of drugs are they doing in the osi building?

So bassically if we want to stay up late on the weekends then the next day were screwed for getting a ph for that day.

If they dont change this i think many people are going to get mad. This is the dumbest thing osi ever did since releasing 3d.

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Vidi

09-10-2001, 05:43 PM

Ive already started a new ebay account

if this isnt changed and soon Ill be selling the items on my accounts and then canceling my account completely

I will not sell the account. I won't quit in anger without hitting OSI in the pocketbook as I go.

Sure its only 20 bucks a month ( a drop in the bucket ) but that 20 bucks less theyll be getting from me

They keep reminding us that UO is ONLY A GAME. Well, I shouldnt need to keep a ledger to figure out if I can work my craftsman again

Vidi- Pure Warrior
Darwin- Tamer Bard Mage ( you hate me )
Thraxas- Mule extrordinaire
Lui- Scribe Alchemist Fisherman
Daevyd S'nna-Archer/Mage

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09-10-2001, 06:09 PM

dont quit come on.

Quiting is just dumb but if we tell them how much we dont like it then they will change it back.

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09-10-2001, 06:17 PM

Makes no difference to me. So people will have to remember when they logged in big deal.

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Ereshkigal

09-10-2001, 06:31 PM

While it makes no diference to me at the moment. Im sure someday Ill want to GM something new and Ill miss it. (I GMed most stuff before PH).

09-10-2001, 06:45 PM

THIS BETTER BE CHANGED, JUST CUZ OSI BLOWS MY , DOESNT MEAN THEY MESS WITH PH, GOD IT IS TOO CONFUSING, LEAVE IT AT A CERTAIN TIME, THE RPG PART OF IT IS, WHEN YOU FIRST WAKE UP RIGHT? WELL THEN HAVE IT SO IT STARTS AT 7 OR 8 LOCAL TIME, BACK THEN THEY WOKE UP AT THAT TIME ABOUT, DO THAT ANYTHING, THIS ME STUFF, IS !

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You See: Luigi *hic* /php-bin/shared/images/icons/pint.gif

Pacrat

09-10-2001, 07:22 PM

One might actually think it means they're listening to anybody(LOL!!!).

It'll be Hell, but it's still inevitable.
They've got it in their minds to do this, no matter the consequences.

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imported_Davo_

09-10-2001, 07:38 PM

i honestly dont understand whats so bad about it............

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Eram

09-10-2001, 07:50 PM

What a bunch of brittle personalities out there.

C'mon folks, it's just another change, and a pretty minor one at that. You still get one PH a day,
if stat rise is what turns you on. The only difference is that we won't all be quite so beset by
the surge in phour-gamers logging in at 11 p.m. Saturday night so they can run off two straight
hours. Big toot. In case you haven't figured it out yet, you can't "win" UO, no matter how hard
you try, or how much you phour-game it.

I wish some of the ranters would head over to Spiels 'n Rants, where this kind of stuff is
an artform, rather than shouting IN ALL CAPS in UHall. *hehe*

09-10-2001, 08:01 PM

I could handle it but i think they should put it back to 12pm again just to make things more simple.

If its not broke dont fix it.

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imported_Davo_

09-10-2001, 08:06 PM

it is broken. the hours it starts are all messed up, arent they?

methinks they cant fix it back to how it was, so they propose a change they might possibly be able to do

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Ingesticide

09-10-2001, 08:16 PM

OMG, if this little tiny change really has you that upset that you want to leave the game over it, then obviously you must just be looking for an excuse for yourself to quit and this game no longer has any value to you. You still get your one PH a day, per character, this change isn't THAT bad, geeeeeeeeeeeeeez, the whining over this tiny alteration is worse than the whining that accompanied older, really nasty changes.

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Dor of Sonoma

09-10-2001, 08:26 PM

...it don't make no nevermind to me.

I could be mistaken, but it seems that the players whom are mainly upset over the change are those whom began playing after Power Hour was initially introduced.

Most vets I know could not care less. Many of us did our best to ignore the danged thing in the first place.

Trust me, folks...it is possible to GM not just one, but SEVERAL skills, without ever, ever using a Power Hour!

Amazing, but true. :-P

~Dor

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09-10-2001, 08:42 PM

I agree. I posted a the bulk of my thoughts on the subject in EagleEyes post below, but to summarize I couldn't care less. Who cares? Dor you are right about when people began playing. Myself and the few people that I know well in game all have accounts bordering on 4 years now, and none of us could care less. I know PH's have been in the game for almost 2 years now, but I honestly still consider them an amusing novelty at best. Almost four years and I have never had a 7Xgm character! And I love UO! Imagine that people, you can have fun and play the game and do not need any skill to be 100, wow what a concept. There are always some people who get mad and leave when a major change goes in(at least major for some people). The funny thing is that they always say how they are leaving and their friends are leaving, but UO some how goes on. To those people who are gonna leave w/o their precious power hour, "Have a nice life, don't let the door hit you in the butt on the way out".

You can't please everybody, that's for sure. I remember when this same craziness was happening in Uhall years ago(remember the original board?), over OSI changing to the current rep system(yes, many of you probably don't know that there was another rep system before the current fame/karma deal). Hehe, people were threatening to quit then too.

The wisest man is he who admits he knows nothing.

Helping Hand

09-10-2001, 08:57 PM

No way. I refuse to believe that. You HAVE to be joking. :)

You know I remember those days, but I do like using PH for those impossible to raise skills (remember 92.something Anatomy, EI, and Hiding anyone?). I myself do not care how they put it in... I am just glad it is in. Sure we could raise skills back then, but I would not wish those kind of gains on my worst enemies.

If they wanna make me happy just bring back Abyss. Wipe the dust off of the server it is probably still stored on and fire it on up.

Primat

09-10-2001, 09:38 PM

Well, I don't like the idea. Not everyone has a regular schedule and in the long run, for me, it'd mean missing powerhours and put me at a disadvantage towards people who get to play more often. I fail to see how this change could be convenient for anyone actually.

Ideally, IMO, power hour should reset during server refresh but I'd rather just see it abolished altogether.

09-10-2001, 10:37 PM

Personally...I can see that people like to have a regular time that they KNOW they will have a PH...
And I can see how people liked having back-to-back power hours....

Yet look at it from this perspective...the new player. I have heard of MANY people complaining at how easy it is for a new player to get started and how "hard" us vets had it. This is a little step in balancing that out...same number of PH's...you just have to use your time a little more wisely.

Apart from all of that though, here is the main reason I LOVE the new ph change: LESS LAG!
I would DREAD being online at midnight or 11pm....cause I new that my lag in UO would increase GREATLY as everyone and their mother all logs in at the same time to train in PH. Now people will be taking their ph at different times than other players...thus there will be less lag for EVERYONE.

So if the Dev team put this question to all of you that are complaining: "If we could reduce the lag during certain times of the day by changing the times of PH, would you be happy about it?"

Personally, I would answer a resounding YES!

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Lemia

09-10-2001, 10:38 PM

For people who don't understand what the big deal is:

1) Power hour cannot be "broken up." If you log onto a character, thus activating his power hour, you HAVE to use that hour NOW. You cannot use 20 mins now, log off, and come back later to use the rest of your power hour

2) You get less power hours if you don't log in every 24 hours.

Example:
You play at night on Monday, so your next PH is Tuesday night.
Tuesday you can only play in the afternoon, so no power hour for you!
Wednesday you play at night again in PH. Your next PH is Thursday night.
Thursday you play in the afternoon (not pH yet remember!), no power hour for you!
Friday you play at night....

Etc, etc, etc

3) no more back to back power hours (not a big deal for me personally)

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Ingesticide

09-10-2001, 11:09 PM

You could NEVER carry over unused PH time that you logged off for. When you logged, that counter kept going, it's always been that way, why so many people don't know that is sooooo far beyond me.

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Helping Hand

09-10-2001, 11:27 PM

Actually it did carry over. This was something told to us Counselors in one of our chats with a member of the "powers that be" that we used to have. They told us straight up that it did carry over and to make sure that if any players asked about it to let them know that.

Ingesticide

09-10-2001, 11:36 PM

That it didn't carry over. Oh well, what matters now is that it won't, so deal. If yer not ready to play UO, then don't play. If something comes up, I think you sacrifice one power hour, it's not going to kill you in any event. PH should have never even been introduced, at least, that's my own opinion, argue if you will, it's more trouble than it ever has been worth. I just couldn't imagine some of these people back before PH, probably all the same ones who exploited every cheat in the game because they couldn't handle actually earning a skill.

Oh well, my debating brings me up to post 4,000 on a side note, heh, always love a good war.

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spinkickr

09-10-2001, 11:45 PM

congrats, whats your big curiousity?

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Helping Hand

09-10-2001, 11:48 PM

Hmmm. I just posted what we as Counselors were told and I am told if I am not ready to play UO then don't? Ok...

Whether it should have been introduced or not it was. It is loved by too many people to ever be taking out (even those of us that "dealt" in the old days).

Even back then there were skills that were ALOT easier than the ones are now even with PH helping. Lockpicking on one chest to GM. The key trick for tinkering. Cancelling the window for bowcraft. Tame/release/retame/release/retame. EI or anatomy on a town crier. LEGAL unattended. Sitting behind a bit of rock to GM Resist or Archery. Provoking the same 2 trapped animals in your house. Dueling polar bears in your house all the way to GM. Using trapped wisps to GM Resist. The list can go on and on. Yes PH made it easier on alot of skills, but there are those that were even easier back than. I myself prefer PH, but I cannot say it was all bad back then.

What most players should be happy about is that they are even doing their best to keep PH in. If I had it my way we would go to RoT on all of the shards and we would get Abyss back.

Ingesticide

09-11-2001, 12:18 AM

They don't get it every night if their schedules won't allow, but they still have it. People should be able to live with the fact that maybe they might miss some PH's, but I just think it's being blown out of proportion for something that isn't even being taken away from them.

My only question is, if it was this way from the start, and it's how people were accustomed to it, would people then whine if they made the change to the old ways?

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Ingesticide

09-11-2001, 12:20 AM

I do not strive to answer these questions, I simply strive to find more questions.

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Helping Hand

09-11-2001, 12:30 AM

Come on now. You know as well as I do there cannot be a change without at least some whining going on. Hmmm. Actually scratch that. I should say MOST changes. Nobody complained when skill locks came in.

The thing that confuses me the most is the same as what quite a few people cannot understand. As you said... there still IS a PH, just in a different time frame system. All should be happy with that. What I think they should do is take it out completely for about one or two weeks then put it in with their new changes. So many people would be happy to get it back they would be too busy celebrating and macroing away to complain...much.

spinkickr

09-11-2001, 12:32 AM

sure be funny is someone say, set the reset to 96 hours instead of 24.....

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Zenroth

09-11-2001, 01:15 AM

Doesnt bother me, but then again im moving to seige and looking forward to ROT when its back in. Oh well

Ambrosia Vayu

09-11-2001, 01:15 AM

My God. I can not believe people are so UPSET over a silly change in power hour! Personally I wish they would do away with it all together. Would these people then quit just because they couldnt GAIN super fast at a certain time? Come on folks...

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09-11-2001, 01:17 AM

Since I've seen posts where people are saying they are going to quit over this minor change, I'd have to say yes they would probably leave.

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09-11-2001, 02:18 AM

I dont care. Personally i would love it, that power hour would be gone! back to basics !!

old scool uo gain methods r the best.

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09-11-2001, 02:20 AM

I would love it if they would leave !!!

they r not real uo players!

they are game abusers.

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09-11-2001, 02:22 AM

...

However it IS a riot seeing all of the "Power Hour ruined UO" people whining at the "nerfing" of Power Hour. I think that furtehr shows that the 3 day GM characters aren't made by newbies, but by Veterans with new characters.

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09-11-2001, 05:08 AM

This change is very dumb. I do not have the time to keep a log book of when each of my chars logs in and when he is in power hour. If I play at 5pm one day the next day my ph is at 5pm, but if I log in late at say 6pm, now my PH is at 6pm. The next day I cant get in till late, like 10pm, now my Damn PH is at 10pm each day unless I decide to skip a day. The I can start the entire nightmare all over again. The only way this will work if there is a green light or something on your paperdoll that lights up during PH. This is just messed up.

Darkblade

09-11-2001, 06:15 AM

Actually you get a sound (sounds like curse?) when your PH starts. ATM you too get an error message but that is being fixed soon (as IGMs say). Dunno if you get another message then :).

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09-11-2001, 06:22 AM

Like curse? u see sparkles too, to say, HEY u r in ph??

omg
hehehe

this really makes me feel like a newbie.. twinkel twinkel little star, now u can gain, weherever u are., name a skill, and name your will, i will make you a Super Star.. GM RESIST

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Wolfran

09-11-2001, 06:45 AM

Due to the hours that i work it means that im only going to get a PH every other day which impreses me little!!
There are more important and pressing things that need to be changed and i dont think power is one of them!!

LEAVE IT AS IT IS OSI U FOOLS!!!

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Aronax of Europa

09-11-2001, 07:00 AM

Since I can only play on weekends and part of Friday, it means that on any one character I'll be reduced from three potential power hours to two unless I reschedule my playing times.

So I'll either lose one or reschedule. I suppose I'll deal with it one way or the other. Unless, of course, they return to the original schedule or have it reset at maintenance, which to me were in all practicality the same.

I really love Dermott's and Dor's comments.

To Ambrosia--if they do away with power hour, they should also do away with the fast gains due to UOA, don't you think?

To those who are planning to quit because of the changes: get real.

And finally, I do have been wondering about the drugs EA/OSI has been imbibing. I've been wondering whether they're really good or really bad. If really good, they must be doing them a lot and neglecting their jobs. If really bad, it must have adversely affected their minds. Either way, the results are the same, wouldn't you say?

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The Working Man

09-11-2001, 07:28 AM

As a player who plays the game, and fits it part-time into a schedule primarily driven by the real world and my priorities there (here), this affects me not at all.
I appreciate eliminating the midnight lag.
I appreciate some kind of a flag letting me know I am in Power Hour so I can adjust my play to suit (if I choose to).
I appreciate that sometimes fixing something means you have to change it.
And, I appreciate that this is a game, not an alternative to my real life, but a toy to help enhance it.
I will reserve my passion for my children, my wife, and my job.
:ighten up. Geeze.

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09-11-2001, 07:54 AM

This change is really not as bad as ppl make it out to be. I mean you get one hour of "power hour" per day per char. That is you can have up to 5 power hours per day if im reading this right. You just need to keep track of when you log in for now. Im sure that the OSI programmers will find out a way to help the players keep track if your in PH or not. You may get some sort of text at log in saying that your in PH. My account is 20 months old and this change is not a big deal to me. I could argue, but why bother. ITS NOT THAT BAD. I mean they could have taken out 8x8. For alot of people that would have killed them!!!! Just play the game jezzzzzzzzzzzz.

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Succabus

09-11-2001, 08:33 AM

the concept is good, IMHO since there are large group of players that work 8 hours a day.

but the actual implementation SUX! it totally screwed up my macro for each charc. and I saw more ERROR line prompt up, not to mention I still haven't heard that sound of PH and GM told me I m bugged?! HTF can I fix myself if you GMs can't fix it for me? unless I own the freaking server!

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09-11-2001, 09:32 AM

I kinda like it the way it is right now. If I want two power hours in a row I just log in at 6pm and log out at 8pm. That's much easier than staying up until 12 midnight to get 2 power hours in a row because I like to sleep.

The ph change will not make much difference for me though because I don't play as much as I used to.

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kilor

09-11-2001, 02:40 PM

Whats the big deal with being able to set your own ph. You can make it for whatever time you want. So what if you miss it. Catch it the following day. Its not like you lost ph all together. Like said before if I wanna work a skill I don't just do the ph. I work it sometimes the whole time I am online. I wish osi would go back to they way it was in the beginning. Get rid of ph all together. And get rid of all the whinners.

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Ubara

09-11-2001, 05:37 PM

Just goes to show how OSI loves to take something that has worked forever and make it completely difficult and unbearble to deal with. I used to be able to log on and know exactly when each of my 10 characters had their power hour. Now I log on and walk around in a stupor wondering if I should go work my skills or stand around and pick my nose.

Ubara
Atlantic

Puppy

09-12-2001, 12:49 PM

I frankly can't understand why people aren't more upset. Unless you can play every single day at the same time for an uninterrupted hour, you simply won't get a power hour every day. To the folks who say that it's great because you can now set your power hour times, you sure can, but the only way to take full advantage of the new system is if you rearrange all your RL activities, events, and emergencies so that you can always play at the same time for a full hour each sitting, or else you lose your power hour for the day. At least the old way I knew that my characters each had a power hour when I first logged them on each day, no matter what time, and if I had to log off before PH was over I could log on later that day and finish up with the time I had left.

No, ultimately it's not a big deal, and I was around way before PH so I'm neither whining because it's been changed nor whining because it hasn't been taken out entirely. I'm just angry that the only people who will now fully benefit from the new system are the ones who apparently have no responsibilities beyond UO. I have a life beyond UO, but when I do play UO I'd like to have the same ability to gain skills as someone who can sit in front of the computer day and night without moving except to go to the bathroom. I'm not a powergamer and I don't want my gains handed to me on a silver platter, but if PH is going to exist then it should be made available CONVENIENTLY to people who can't always play at the same time every day. Without PH you have to use a lot more raw materials when working crafts skills, which take a long time simply to gather, and crafts skills are what I enjoy most about the game.

Vote for my new horse hue idea <a target="_blank" href=http://uodr.stratics.com/ideas/messages/9970528725653.html>here</a>

MinorMage

09-12-2001, 12:59 PM

Right on target Puppy.

PH was created for the casual gamer and to get rid of unattended macroing.

So much for the casual gamer.....

BanMeNot

09-12-2001, 02:11 PM

That new PH changes is really bad, this is hard to keep track when is the char.'s ph come (my barebone computer don't have Sound card), Man :( , I really suggust OSI should keep the old ph schedules as midnight. New PH changes makes player harder to gain skills, REALLY REALLY BAD IDEA.

BanMeNot

Aleata

09-12-2001, 08:35 PM

Ok I again tried to work my power hour and even got the tone telling me i was in power hour.... this is the 5th char in a row that i have tried and gotten ZERO power hour on over a 3 day time period.... I don't know if others are seeing this but my husband is having exactly the same results on his chars that I am...

NOT happy about NO gains :(

09-13-2001, 12:59 AM

Lol im starting to like all this hehehe..

back to the old days,

WB veterans,

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09-13-2001, 01:07 AM

*realized provo just got harder to gain*
Damn it!

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09-13-2001, 01:18 AM

So far for your money making days hehe

AAh this is the balance they were talking about, and gold sinks , hehehe

LOL

harder to raise skills, is: bring magery to GM, will cost you again 180K on regs

etc etc LOL

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09-13-2001, 02:03 AM

I never really made any money, even with a high bard I'm still poor :)
Nah someone will find a loophole like 8x8 and find a way to GM things fast.

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DeadCal

09-13-2001, 02:11 AM

It doesn't even seem to work properly though. My new tamer and my scribe have had appalling gains since the changes. There may as well not be a PH now.

Lady DeadCal - Warrior/healer - kill or cure
Lady TerminalCal - Tamer/Mage
Kitty DeVine - Entertainer
Jones - Miner, smith, alchemist, inscriber, all round reg furnace

09-13-2001, 02:23 AM

lol

who knows.

bugs wil always be there..

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Ingesticide

09-13-2001, 11:04 PM

Ya know? There's so many tricks and bugs and things like 8x8 and all, that even resist has its methods to be brought high quick these days. UO skills are almost now meaningless, there's a trick to GM just about anything with good speed.

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xor_conan

09-13-2001, 11:23 PM

I like the new changes, like someone said ealier
"Having tons of real world responsiblities" this system is easier for people who have lifes

09-14-2001, 01:02 AM

indeed

remember the old days too huh
hehe

Hay, i got my vet rewardz. :p

*Grinz*

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Captain Newbie

09-14-2001, 02:08 PM

the phone rings. a guy (some ppl would call him bofh) picks up.

Yes, hello? - Ah boss its you. - Yes, i know the computers arent working. - Why your asking. Seems to be (looks at the excuse calendar) some strange kind of computer virus. - Well, you can use the typewriter in the office next to yours - Oh, please no reason for yelling, cause the computers did not totaly breakdown, they are working for one hour each day.- I am sure that youll find out at what hour they are functioning or ask your vendor. - When will i fix it? No, no, fixing it would just take too much time. Its not worth it. And by the way we have a lot less useless network traffic, youll get your files a lot faster. - Stop yelling, please its really a lot better that way. - No i wont come to your office now, i am going home, my power hour is starting soon. - What? you dont know what power hour is? its the thing that OUR gods gave us. - No, no, you dont understand not just a god, its OUR GODS.

Hangs up the phone.

09-15-2001, 01:04 PM

i think it is stupid as it will **** off a lot of people, even thoughs who don't consider themselves powergamers but would like to use poer hour when it suits them.personally i don't care too much, i can live without working skills every day, and i think it will do a few people good to get out of the "i deserve these esay skill gains every day" mentality.

IMHO, scrap power hour altogether. I think that the idea of gaining off failures has a fatal flaw that means it should be scrapped: if you know you will gain off failures you will do everything possible to fail (enter a whole bunch of "exploits"). I think it should work like this:

power hour:
increased reasonable chance to gain from succeeding from the "hard things"
reasonable chance to gain off the "things you can succeed at 50-70 of the time at"
low chance to gain from the easy things

increased chance to gain off failures of the "hard things", but cannot gain off failures more than 3 times in a row, after 3 gains in a row off failures, you cannot gain from failures again till you gain off a success.

still gives good gains, but makes it far less exploitable.

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Roke of Sonoma

09-15-2001, 01:29 PM

OK, so now if you're, say, 10 minutes into power hour and you lose your connection and it takes you 5 minutes to log back in, you have 45 minutes of ph left, or no ph left at all?

OSI has screwed up. Considering what ph was originally intended for, there is no way anyone can say this has been an improvement (see Puppy's post above for a well stated argument of this point). For those of you who don't seem to mind that OSI has made of feature of the game worse than it used to be, please do not complain when they also screw up the feature you currently can't live without. It's not a question of if this will happen but when, and when it does, you will have given up your right to complain about it if you're indifferent to this current situation. If OSI changes for the worse ANY feature of this game, every paying customer has good reason to be angry about it.

Roke

09-15-2001, 02:01 PM

yes waht they ahve done is stupid because, as i said it will **** off not just the powergamers, but those who just want to be able to use powerhour *when they want it*

"please do not complain when they also screw up the feature you currently can't live without" - are you trying to say that because i don't mind living without power hour and have not complained that i now ahve no right to complain about things i do care about? that makes little sense.
If it were up to me power hour would be very different, as i asid in my previous posts, i'd make it reset at 12, or server up, and it would not allow insta gms like we have now, then i would have more consistant gains outside of power hour, but on a ROT basis.

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Martyr - Cat

09-15-2001, 02:16 PM

They should flat out do away with the ph and let us go back to the old days.

Just an opinion.

09-15-2001, 02:32 PM

sorry but macroing was jsut as bad, the anti macro code should stay but 8x8 should be eliminated and power hour should be re-thought.

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Roke of Sonoma

09-15-2001, 05:22 PM

I guess what I was trying to say, brave, is that everyone, regardless of how they feel about ph, should be pissed off when OSI screws up. If someone has an idea on how to improve ph, or someone thinks doing away with it all together is an improvement then that's fine. But if someone doesn't care that OSI screwed up because this particular problem doesn't affect them then some day, when they are crying about a problem that does, I will have no sympathy for them. There may be some people who think what's happened to ph is an improvement, but if they're out there, I haven't read an argument from them that is more convincing than Puppy's (who I cited in my first post).

In summary: There is good reason to be mad at OSI whenever they screw up, not just when the screw up affects you, because we are all paying good money for this game, and therefore deserve a quality product.

(BTW in case you thought otherwise, my first post was not directed at you in particular, yours was just last in the list so I replied to it. I was not commenting on anything you said, but on what any apathetic poster on this thread may have said in any post.)

Roke

PS - Does any one know what happens when your ph gets interupted? I realize it doesn't start back up where you left off, but do you get whatever time is left in your hour?

09-16-2001, 02:32 AM

once you log in, you ahve an hour of power hour. so if you log in for 1 min then log out, the counter is ticking. if you log in 20 mins later you ahve 40 mins left.

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Lady Malynn

09-16-2001, 09:22 AM

I really dislike the new PH system. My main issue is that the future ph start times depend on the start time you establish today. I sometimes work late irl. If I log in the character I'm working on, that establishes her ph start time later than I really want it to be. I worked late twice last week, so I didn't log that char in at all and missed ph's all together.

I'm a morning person, and love the stat gains at server up on Saturday and Sunday mornings. But, now that means I have to not log in my char at all on Friday if I want to take advantage of ph's on the weekend mornings.

Another incidence this week. A friend wanted armor repaired late on a weekend night this week. If I logged in my smithy (I'm trying to gm tinkering on her), I would establish ph at 10:30 pm.. no way I wanted to do that.

All this inconvenience in one week of ph for one UO player.

I really hope the dev team rethinks this. Just be big about it, admit the goof, revert, and let's move on.

 GOD BLESS AMERICA

Vanquisher of the Arachnid

Roke of Sonoma

09-16-2001, 07:18 PM

Another question. I've noticed that I can log on and I don't hear the "start" sound for a couple minutes. If I log back off before I hear that noise has my ph started or not?

I used to think OSI wasn't so bad and I wondered why everyone complained about them so much. Now I know.

Roke

spinkickr

09-16-2001, 07:44 PM

hrmm, good question

id have to say, no, but it your waiting that 5 minutes to log out, when it happens, then yes

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09-17-2001, 07:13 AM

"I think that the idea of gaining off failures has a fatal flaw that means it should be scrapped: if you know you will gain off failures you will do everything possible to fail (enter a whole bunch of "exploits")."

You've forgotten that you also gain off successes. You've forgotten that you still have material losses with failures. Or have you never played a smith or a tailor? The only difference between power hour and regular time is the CHANCE to gain off failures.

Much like real life. It's called "practice." Ever try to learn to play a musical instrument? How far would you get if you only learned when you played things correctly? It's hitting the bad notes that gives you feedback that you need to do something different and it's at THAT point that learning occurs.

If UO was to be more realistic, you would be gaining off failures all day long, not just for a single hour.

*******************

No bartenders--FIX THE BUGS! /php-bin/shared/images/icons/disgust.gif

Real men don't use UOA.

I renounce all facet citizenshipry. *you see Cynewulf, the Man Without a Facet*

Explorer 93%, Socializer 60%, Achiever 46%, Killer 0%

09-17-2001, 11:43 AM

my post must have either gone totally over your head, or you are a power gamer....

the fact is that power hour REWARDS failing, im thinking about magery here: you fail you gain, you go forward eight, you fail, you gain, you go forward eight, etc etc etc... that is the flaw, and changing it so that you cannot gain from failures more than 3 times in a row will be a vast improvement to the system. i dont have a problem with learning from mistakes, i do have a problem from exploiting the flaw in the power hour philosophy.

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cus we're three mc's and one dj, and we be gettin' down with no delay, so mix master mike, what ya got to say?

09-17-2001, 12:37 PM

Ah. So your real problem is 8x8. You should have said so to begin with. As I pointed out, in RL your skillgains come from failure. I see nothing wrong with that happening in-game. You're real point is that you feel that 8x8 is exploiting that. Valid point.

Power gamer? I can only play on weekends. In other words, I may be able to do about 4 power hours a week. Currently I'm training resist. Against monsters because I don't do magery. If that makes ma a power gamer, so be it.

And now a totally unrelated question: do you use UOA?

*******************

No bartenders--FIX THE BUGS! /php-bin/shared/images/icons/disgust.gif

Real men don't use UOA.

I renounce all facet citizenshipry. *you see Cynewulf, the Man Without a Facet*

Explorer 93%, Socializer 60%, Achiever 46%, Killer 0%

09-17-2001, 01:37 PM

i have issues with 8x8 and power hour, i think there are much better ways to allow "reasonable" skill gains without rearding those who will do everything they can to fail (factions exploit eq scroll trick for eval and so on).

Do i use UOA? lol, yes, but only to apply bandages, drink pots and change weapons. I suppose real men dont use UOAM either? pre empting your reasons for not using UOA, i think power hour is far worse for the "life" of the game than UOA.

<center>http://sweetuopics.homestead.com/files/grr1.gif</center>
cus we're three mc's and one dj, and we be gettin' down with no delay, so mix master mike, what ya got to say?

09-17-2001, 02:01 PM

I don't know whether real men use UOAM or not. I use the map that came in the box and all my characters have a sextant.

I agree. It would be best (and I've said this until people cringe when I say it again) that people should be able to gain skills reasonably while simply playing. Wouldn't it be nice so be able to GM Healing, for example, by simply fighting monsters and healing? I'm trying to GM healing on Sonoma. Yes, I could jump on a boat and 8x8 it in a few hours. I've read here that when you hit about 77.0, to jump on a boat and do it.

I once had a healer at 96.4 for six months without budging. Not even all the resurrecting at the Trinsic invasion helped. I finally gave up, jumped on a boat, and GMed it (in five excrutiatingly boring hours). They may have tweaked now so it is no longer broken. My Sonoma healer passed 81.0 this weekend from simply playing. During power hour the gain was 0.3. All from successes, by the way. That kind of gain is acceptable to me. No reason go jump on a boat if I can see some gains while having fun.

But if it's only 0.3 per hour at 81, what is it at 91? 95? Will I be going for another six months without a gain? Before going and getting rid of power hour, 8x8, or any of that other stuff, something needs to take place first. *points to signature* Yep, the bugs have to be fixed.

The skills may be broken, but by God we have the bartenders we've been clamoring about.

*******************

No bartenders--FIX THE BUGS! /php-bin/shared/images/icons/disgust.gif

Real men don't use UOA.

I renounce all facet citizenshipry. *you see Cynewulf, the Man Without a Facet*

Explorer 93%, Socializer 60%, Achiever 46%, Killer 0%

09-17-2001, 02:19 PM

well we agree.

and UOAM is not as much fun as the map that came with the game, but at the same time i'd rather let UOA and UOAM map out the housing on shards than try to draw it in myself on that map. It's also reasonalby useful in ilshenar, altough i'd prefer it if there were some markings to say where things are... wont stop me dying but might help a little.

<center>http://sweetuopics.homestead.com/files/grr1.gif</center>
cus we're three mc's and one dj, and we be gettin' down with no delay, so mix master mike, what ya got to say?

KITH

09-17-2001, 04:43 PM

Well I been playing thios game for along time,as many of the peopel who says they dont care about ph, hmmm I wouldnt mind them removing it , but making it being unusable by some thats not cool, I have 4 accounts, and its more than apin to keep track of when ph last was on all those, and for those, i dont need a 7 x gm char, hmmm I played this game for, oldest account say's 46 months, but I dont have a 7 x gm , I have alot of 5 x gm's and a few 6 x gm's , but if you gonnag play stuff like factions, ya wont get wery fare with ya 2xgm old shool mages, well unless ya a speedhacking SOB, so they either fix the danm thing, and by that I meen make it usefull to all players , or freaking get rid of it, I myself would prefer ROT , but thats me

Explorer 73%
Socializer 66%
Killer 33%
Achiever 26%

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Vorlani

09-19-2001, 12:52 PM

I think this is mostly affecting those people that play all the time and used to set up power hours back to back on multiple characters. Having played three accounts all of which are nearing four years, and only playing aproximately 3 hours a week anymore, it does not make a difference to me. I only use a single power a week if I am lucky because I do not get the thrills off of seeing numbers rise ever hour im available to play. So goes it i suppose, but I do agree that is mostly the 3 hour 5x warrior/mage players that are complaining about this =P

megreebo

09-20-2001, 03:01 AM

The power hour changes are no big deal. However, since the Vet Rewards have been released some folks need something new to complain about. Guess this is it. Lighten up folks...it's just a game!

Jimmy_of_SBR

09-21-2001, 01:05 PM

Powerhour was originally implemented to make up for alot of skill problems late last year (or year before? can't remember) when we'd go weeks without seeing gain in some skills. It just kindof stuck around and became the new status quo. IMO, it was more rewarding (albeit much slower) before powerhour, and I think it's spoiled us. After 3 years of being a 'casual' player I've watched most of my companions ingame become unavailable to play due to the fact they're maxing skill gain...and then logging. UO has lost some of it's flavour to the fast n' easy skill gain track, and I think the proposed changes will help even things out alittle. Who'd rather adventure and gain skill alittle rather than sit in a house and poison/heal themselves? Quite a few, I think.

There's more to this game than maxing some skills then bragging about it. Everyone's in it for different reasons, and the new proposals aim at making skill gain into a more 'even' and manageable system for everyone. Sure, everyone cries about it now...but how many of those people actually gm'd multiple skills before powerhour was implemented (or more to the point, were around)? The old timers still remember what a challenge it was, and the feeling of accomplishment that went with it.

As for now, even a lazy, 3 hour a week player like me can gm a skill quickly and then flaunt it at the nearest bank.

Jimmy

*Prepares for the rants and general babble that follows someone reading someone else's opinion that isn't their own*

09-21-2001, 05:15 PM

Power Hour (officially known as "Burst Hour") came to pass early last year, slightly before UO:R was released, in what we called the "skills patch" which also introduced skill locks and non-macroing code (which led to 8x8).

This poll was created BEFORE the latest announcement of GGS (which, in my opinion, looks suspiciously like ROT).

*******************

No bartenders--FIX THE BUGS! /php-bin/shared/images/icons/disgust.gif

Real men don't use UOA.

I renounce all facet citizenshipry. *you see Cynewulf, the Man Without a Facet*

Explorer 93%, Socializer 60%, Achiever 46%, Killer 0%

spinkickr

09-21-2001, 09:57 PM

you noticed that too? eehehe

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Isulminous Karan

09-22-2001, 05:44 AM

i have never cared for the power hour, nor will i ever, however this new system in concept, the GSG thingy ... thats great, cause now you can do what i have done for the longest time now and still gain skill ...

"You better not hope ... you better know."

Dcats46

09-22-2001, 07:51 AM

Now would be a good time to revert to the good ole days. No ph, no tenths shown. Give it a year, and then ask if they would like a powerhour again.
Makes you feel good to know you gmed something the hard way :)

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Brior Quickstep

09-22-2001, 04:32 PM

...Me and my friends are definetly leaving UO now since osi finally nerfed even PH. It gives the game a fine meaningless never accounted for ever in any game. What where they thinking off? Thou may only learn after a certain time,and in between thou art a moron...So osi, we are morons, we get our gains in Dark Ages of Camelot instead.

*makes a peacesign and lites some herbs from Papua*

Hu....!!!???
Nope not my dragon sorry

Phantom Rose

09-23-2001, 11:37 AM

LOL well so you quit and that creates less lag for the rest of us...buh bye! :) How stupid is this? Think about it people. I love that I get an hour to actually gain in something that seems impossible! The only gripe I have is that we cannot choose that time. I posted in another thread about choosing when we take the ph and if that could be done... WOW how cool! But to quit playing the game because of this is just dumb and I think you were looking for a reason to quit in the first place. You won't hurt Origin by quitting cus for every one of you there are 10 more out buying the game as we speak.

09-24-2001, 01:08 AM

I said to fast that i didnt like the changes in the power hour.

Now, when we have the option to say powerhour, it makes things easier.

I am happy now with this system as it now is.

Greets

Allright Kupo!

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09-24-2001, 10:06 AM

yeh ..cant see why anybody would quit over *changes* even the suckiest of em..cuz we all know sooner or later a change gets changed ..and often there is a patch that patches a new patch etc etc..its like the weather..if ya dont like it ..wait..it will all change again...again ! :) Now IF I am in the mood to up some skill on some chr. yes I LIKE that chr to actually GAIN from working the skill or skills I would like them to up. With this new change..and my work sked. all I did was kinda juggle some chrs around ..so no biggie for a couple of 24hr periods they got nada..cuz basically I was *stacking * the few whom NEED help most ..to be able to have a ph when I WANTED THEM to..now I have it so those 3 chrs. are back to back when I get off work :) DOH just move chrs around when ya have time to play em..log em in dork around log out..oh my that chrs NEXT ph is now.. that is all I did..just moved the chrs time to when I felt like dorkin with PHS.and now I have 3 set up for phs when I want em to have ph.it just took blowing some time PLAYING the game ..not phing to juggle em to a time slot I prefered for PHing chrs. Im trying to get my fisherman to also be a chef..silly lil thing he wants to do cuz never had a chef ..no biggie I juggled him around time wise so now I get off rl work log him on and IT IS his ph now at 11pm every 24 hrs period..and he cooks :) skills fly np :) Concidering I had to move his tail from 8am to 11pm no easy task :) but I did it. Now my QZ chr is basically FINISHED in my opinion only a few things I plan to up in her skills..If I log her on and get the ph and I feel I need to restock her many vendors..pfft screw ph.. no biggy..to me..yet IF i want her resist to up get two choices..dont restock go slap some monsters restock after ph or..skip a whole day not use her and up her resist when say game hubby gonna be on to heal me while I smack the stuff to up the resist.:)So with that chr its a bit trickier IF I want to ph with her..but pfft dang it this is a game...I have 10 chrs on two accts and at this point I could care less if it their ph or not..if i WANT to use the ph then I will do that..and if I want to just go play another chr NOT in ph instead that IS what I do. The other day it was a ph for a chr I have needing to gm lbjk she close .. but some friends wanted to smack daemons with warriors...coulda taken the one NEEDING TO UP skill ..or pfft take the one that can drop a daemon as she is now.. hehe np took the pro :) I just do NOT see why peeps get bent out of shape over phs or skill uppings..every chr can use work..and yet every chr is also for playing something..it is up to us what we make of our time..and up to us whether we want to use it wisely ..or dork about..and /or one CAN just juggle your chrs about that NEED the work..give it a week and those chrs ARE STACKED ready to go when you are ready TO PH each one , one right after the other. Thats what I did I just moved the ones needing the most work around the 24hr timeperiods and wallah presto..the ones most needing PHS should I so opt to use em are now stacked tog in a row IF i want to ph them. I also like the feature typing in the word *powerhour* giving me a clock to work with..to do whatever I need to do and tells me what I needed to know to ..juggle em and move em about to suit MY timing...sure beats the lag of the entire planet at midnite every nite doing ph same time..now IF I want em..they are on MY timing..NP ! Works for me..but then most times I rather PLAY than be some gerbil on a wheel uppin skills uppin skills uppin skills..afterall I gmd tailoring whilst ophidians and terras invaded Delucia fel. with no ph lots of untimely deaths to get that 100.0 but dang it..I was determined to gm tailoring on a warrior and did so no pH back then no oil cloths nada..and suffered invasions from fatal things IN TOWNS at that time ..no matter ..in my opinion if ya WANT to gm something yu will. Just some skills got majorly messedup and they needed to do something to try to help up skills..thus the ph ............................well anyhow it is going to be what yu make of it..just like the entire game is that way...work work work or PLAY> up to yu ! As for me.. I play the game.. !

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naxor

09-25-2001, 08:20 PM

I took like 30 minutes to get a password and login just for this post

I HATE THE NEW POWER HOUR!!

Here is why:

Dear OSI hopefully constructive - youve made a great game but this is one thing you should seriously consider - I hope you read this

originall, power hour was designed for players who dont play ALL day - so they could still gain skills reasonably - the new changes have done exactly the opposite! -
take me for example- a good representation of a player who doesnt play a ton - maybe 1-2 hours, 3 or 4 times a week
presumably power hour was desinged to give casual players like me a fighting chance against people who play 6-8+ hours a DAY
So - heres what happens - when I used to play sometimes it would be in the morning - somtimes in the afternoon, sometimes evening - either way, I'd always get a powerhour
Now I find that I get one about every OTHER day - I ussually will play in the evening - then the next day when I play in the afternoon I dont get one, worse, if the NEXT day I am playining in the morning - I will miss a THIRD day
Meanwhile the - people who play all the time get power hour after powerhour every day - this was the advantage PH was designed to prevent
I see people who play all the time saying - "Ok just 6 hours 20 minutes till my next PH"
this is not what it was designed for
I know the new servers have to account for some time difference and the PH change was made so as not to inconviencence certain players but I can almost guarantee that these players are not casual ones like me but power players who play all day
I suggest that the PH be made a once per day thing- if the particular time of day is 3pm or whatever that is still better than the 24 hours of play time and I can almost guarantee that this is what will give the most players the most opportunity for PH - and thats the goal

thaNKS!

krazykilroy

09-26-2001, 12:32 PM

GEEZ!!!

1) <blockquote><hr>

This change is very dumb. I do not have the time to keep a log book of when each of my chars logs in and when he is in power hour. If I play at 5pm one day the next day my ph is at 5pm, but if I log in late at say 6pm, now my PH is at 6pm. The next day I cant get in till late, like 10pm, now my Damn PH is at 10pm each day unless I decide to skip a day. The I can start the entire nightmare all over again. The only way this will work if there is a green light or something on your paperdoll that lights up during PH. This is just messed up.

<hr></blockquote>

this is how it happened everytime with the original powerhour setting at 12 AM. When I came home at 5 PH was at 5, the next day if I didn't start until 6 PH was at 6. Yes sometimes you will miss a PH or 2, but it was meant for the casual gamer

2) I can tell when PH will start by saying "powerhour" this way I don't have to log in and waste 10-20 of PH time buying GP kegs to work up poisoning. I also don't have to shut off the game at 11:55 so that I don't waste my PH.

krazykilroy

09-26-2001, 12:37 PM

<blockquote><hr>

once you log in, you ahve an hour of power hour. so if you log in for 1 min then log out, the counter is ticking. if you log in 20 mins later you ahve 40 mins left.

<hr></blockquote>

this was the way it has always been as well. just now if you come home from work and log on you're not immediately thrown into PH like the good old days. I only see that as a good thing, when I don't have to go, "oh I forgot to get _____ to work on my PH"

09-27-2001, 01:45 AM

I think its good, it keeps the whiners out of the game like u.

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blpjmiller

09-27-2001, 09:39 AM

I believe that if the goal for skill gain is to encourage "normal" play, then this would be a good solution to achieve that, without taking away powergamers gains, or taking away casual players gains.

1. Powerhour concept gone completely.
2. Gains only on success (beyond 70 skill) of a similarly difficult action for that skill (where relevent)
3. Rate over time concept (but not the way it used to be implemented on SP).

The Rate over time concept should be the "playing time" not the "server" or "real" time. Server or real time only encourages logging in and out periodically to get your "guaranteed" skill gain (which rendors this option useless for the goal of "normal" game play). However, if you have a setting of, say 5 minutes per .1 gain from 70.0 - 79.9, 10 minutes per gain from 80.0 - 89.9, 20 minutes per gain from 90.0 - 98.9 and 30 minutes per gain from 99.0 - 100.0 of actual playing time, then a player will have no use for repeated (macroing) use of a skill to gain their skill. At high levels, they would have a need to go do something else (on this character, in game) while they wait for their time to expire for that skill. The "something else" could easily be, using ANOTHER skill on that character.

Also, you don't have to make the skill gain "guaranteed" after the time expires, but instead "possible". So, just because you sit at the bank for 10 minutes talking since your last FS spell, you don't cast one FS and get your next gain, you may have to cast several spells before you actually get your gain, but the fact that the timer expires, means that you now have a chance of gaining.

In this type of gain system, a mage, who camps out in a dungeon, would be periodically gaining skill in magery, eval intel, meditation, resist, healing, anatomy, wrestling, just for fighting monsters in the dungeon. This would be TRUE "normal" game play, and it would allow the person to gain while their at it. At high levels, they wouldn't gain very fast, but they would surely gain every time their clock time passed, since they are using all of those skills all of the time. In this system, you would see no more mages on a boat (unless their fishing :) Currently, if you want to gain magery fast, you get on a boat, 8x8, WASTE a ton of regs, and boom, your a GM. It is not only BORING, but WASTEFUL and ANNOYING (not to mention the complete opposite of "normal"). But it is currently the only effective way to GM a mage. Believe me, I would much rather be spending my time casting EV on a drake or FSing a lich to gain my skills to GM. At least I could cover the cost of my regs.

Likewise, a warrior would gain periodically in their skills by using them over play time in a dungeon.

Mule characters would have a harder time with this system, since macroing would be really non-effective (or non-efficient anyway) unless they are filling an order. Most mule characters are working a number of skills anyway, so they could simply move from skill to skill to get their gains in that skill.

This type of system would work for both powergamers (who will continue to gain periodically no matter how long they play) as well as casual players (who would periodically gain the entire time they play, whether it's 4 hours one night a week, or 1 hour four nights a week).

I don't know about the rest of you (but I'm sure I will soon :) but I personally would LOVE a skill gain system like this. I think (certainly for me) it would make the game fun again, because I wouldn't have to worry or care about powerhouring to gain skill, I would know that by simply playing the game, I would gain skill at every level. And THAT, would be fun.